Hi December!

Thanks for explaining your comment further (now it is clear to me what you meant) and no, I didn´t take it as unkind, only kind of unhappy, which as I said makes it even more interesting in a way. You don´t discourage me, I never expected all the readers to be happy with this story so if it is at least believable, that is the very best I could expect. Besides, I know you mean well :)
And yes, I had not thought about the awkwardness and laughability of the situation they land themselves in, but I see your point. On the other hand, if anyone thought Faramir was a poor lonely bachelor, it would kind of lift up his reputation, wouldn´t it? Anyway.
Your story. I have to admit that the last chapter kind of unsettled me, so I was waiting for the next one to comment. But now I guess your curiosity is aroused, so I´ll try to give you a full analysis as soon as I can (which might well be next year, alas!).
In the meanwhile, thanks again for your explanations and let me know as soon as you keep reading the story! Hugs,

Hi again!

No, no, the meaning of my comment was not as unkind as it looks you’ve taken it to be… Let me try to clarify that.

By my words about laughing at the circumstances of the discovery, I meant that it struck me as rather funny that they were caught not by Aragorn, or Gandlaf, or somebody equally important, but by some fundamentally nonessential guy who just happened to be there because he can’t stay out of other people’s business. To my mind, this does a good job of showing that Faramir and Arwen’s thing is not only a perilous affair (which in a way can be seen as romantic and exhilarating, as love against danger, etc) – but also holds the threats of embarrassment, awkwardness and laughability. I just imagined how, when they saw that he saw them, Arwen would probably start climbing off Faramir all in a panic, and likely she wouldn’t be particularly graceful about it, and that guy would see her wet c#nt, and – I mean, Arwen, look at your choices, girl! Is this the life you wanted for yourself?

You see what I mean? Lol

By polarising I mean that this is a plot-line that’s bound to leave some readers grumbly and unhappy, maybe even wishing to have the author’s head, lol. We are so used to seeing Faramir as a perfect man – but he is a man nonetheless, and certainly not one altogether without fault. Certainly he too can make poor choices. And frankly, I don’t really buy into his justification that he’s doing this for everyone else’s good. I think he’s more than anything just deluding himself… For one thing, he did this partly so that she wouldn’t rat on him to Aragorn – this is not a high motive, this is just him bbeing afraid for his dignity and good name – which is very understandable, but not in any way noble or altruistic. Besides, speaking of Gondor’s best interests, if she bore a son from Faramir and that son would become King, how right would that be…? And also, it’s quite a short-sighted decision – sure, he did keep her happy so long as no one knew, but now what? Could Aragorn ever get over something like this? But of course, like I acknowledged before, pity and compassion definitely did play a big part for Faramir, and maybe he thought of his mum who too had wilted in a likely unhappy marriage… Anyway, he’s done what he’s done, so there’s no point talking about whether it was ok or not.

And the difference from the situation with the Ring, I think, is that he never wanted the Ring in the first place.

Sticky was maybe a poor choice of word. I was looking for a word to convey that this story is impossible to shake off, that I couldn’t stop from returning to it in thought. It’s very disturbing – which I say not as criticism or as compliment, but just in the plain meaning of the word. Faramir sleeping with Arwen behind Aragorn’s back – to me that’s disturbing, lol. And that’s a not so frequent combination for me, a LOTR story that’s at the same time disturbing and believable. (Here I must make a note that all the Faramir/Boromir lovestories out there to me are not inherently disturbing, heh).

To me the number one reason for stopping to read a fanfic is when I perceive the behaviours/feelings depicted as out-of-character, most often gratuitous sex or servile/undignified kind of conduct. Also explicit gore, because that’s something I just really don’t like. But in your story, although the characters’ behaviour is not something likely to have come up in many of Tolkien’s imaginings, heh, I still can’t say that they’re being out of character… It’s a fine line to walk, to challenge the readers’ understanding of the characters, to make the readers debate the likelihood of such behaviour – because if the readers did not find it at least 50% possible, they would not be debating, they would simply stop reading ;)

I want to assure you that I in no way mean to discourage you with my comments. I see my words are not always understood the way I intend, so just know they are all well-intended.

Anyway, of course it’s quite silly to speak so much without having read the rest, but you know… It’s a long journey for me.

Thanks for your kind words re my own writing. If you have anything specific to say about the chapter of Hungry Eyes, I’d much appreciate a comment, but no pressure :) Hope your creative juices are flowing well!

Hi December!

Well, I must say I didn’t understand all the nuances of your comment, which is frustrating because what you say is so interesting in many ways… What do you mean by “it cracked me up how absurd the discovery of their secret was” and “if it weren’t for the nosy arrogant fools who just must find out”?
Same about the “polarising” and “sticky” story, I’m not sure I understand exactly what you mean. I understand you wanted to give up the reading or tell yourself it wasn’t credible and yet something made you keep reading: is that correct?
If so, that’s a great compliment: being able to keep a reader reading against their will is a great feat :) and by the tone of your comment (kind of reluctant and not happy) it looks like I did exactly that. Well, it would be easy to gain readers by writing exactly what they want to read, but… not very interesting, right?
I’m impressed both by the fact that it took you so much time to work up the courage to keep reading, and by the fact you finally did (and will continue, I’m sure). That really shows how deeply this story got to you!
I love your comparison of Arwen to a cat, that really describes this Arwen in a nutshell. Still, I believe Faramir would never have given in solely to her charm or her willpower – I mean, if he can resist the ring… – it’s the good he sees in her and the pity he has for her and, don’t forget, the fact he has Aragorn’s and Gondor’s best interests at heart… I hope that is some consolation.
And maybe you’ll need to read the rest of the story, but at the end of it I realized that this wasn’t only about a hard choice for Faramir, but for all of them… and even if Arwen’s inner debate is not shown in the story, we should not underestimate it. She is quite selfish, but also quite sensitive, and loving, and she even has some conscience, I think…
On the other hand, Faramir, while quite noble at heart, is not really the “moral” sort of character that always follows the rules. He’s not at all afraid of going against the rules and when he decides to do something, he doesn’t care that much about what others might think…
Again, thanks for this very sincere comment: “the praise of the praiseworthy is above all rewards”, and in a way, it is even more flattering because it is not given gladly, but given all the same. “You make it so damn believable”, that compliment I will remember for quite some time, I think. It really means the world.
And now I must say I read your last chapter of Hungry Eyes and a Blade of Steel and I am looking forward to the next one :). In the meantime, have a very good end of year and start of new one!

Hello there. Long time no see, heh.

I must confess, upon reading the chapter that uncovers Faramir’s decision, it’s been taking me a long while to decide whether I could be comfortable with a stiuation where Faramir makes such, hm, questionable choices. But then I figured, well, the whole inner debate is a bit hypocritical in the sense that when it comes to my own writing, making the reader ‘comfortable’ is never among my goals, so hardly would it be fair to ask that of others :D So here I am, for better or worse, lol.

What I must commend is that this whole story, while certainly quite polarising, is yet qrather ‘sticky’, too. What I mean is that I couldn’t just go, ‘I don’t like his actions, I’m not going to read this’ – I had all sorts of negative reactions both to Arwen’s and especially to Faramir’s conduct, and yet somethign kept me… I reckon the main reason is that much as I would love to say, ‘no, there’s no way Faramir would ever do that’ – I can’t, because you make it so damn believable. With any other woman, even Eowyn, I wouldn’t have bought it that he would effectively go behind Aragorn’s back – but Arwen… And here I must say I truly appreciate your characterisation of her. If anything, you give her more depth, realism and three-dimensionality than even the original character in the book seemed to me. Fair enough, her portrayal in the movie also did add her life, but I truly did not appreciate how PJ turned her into yet another rebellious warrior princess which she clearly wa snot. You, on the other hand, stay well in line with her original depiction while at the same time developing the hints one may read between Tolkien’s lines. We know she did come to regret her decision in the end – which goes to suggest she could well have, given according circumstances, come to regret it well before the end. And I like the aura of ‘elfness’ you give her. In this story more than anywhere else I’m reminded of her formidable lineage, specifically of Galadriel, the latter not coming across as all flowers and smiles, not at all. This Arwen is like a cat, sweet and demure until the moment her tail is stepped upon. She has her own interests at heart, she is not particularly interested in the common good of all humanity, she feels no need to tell everyone everything. This is no longer a classic princess in waiting for her prince on the white steed, but rather a capricious faerie queen, willful and demanding, not much eaten at by conscientous thoughts. Poor Faramir. Who, to think of it, could resist? If it were Eomer in his place, I would not have even wondered – even in the book Eomer expresses a great fascination with Arwen, to the point of willing to challenge Gimli to battle. And Faramir, “being a man whom pity deeply stirred” – how could he deny a damsel in distress, add to it the whole Elven glamour thing…? All this just underscores Arwen’s nearly supernatural female powers, that she could lure one like him off his path…

Here I confess I yet have to work up the courage to learn what happens as the news gets out – because, you know, poor Aragorn. But I must add it really cracked me up how absurd the discovery of their secret was. Ah, if it weren’t for the nosy arrogant fools who just must find out…

I meant, I meant… yyy…it was partially truth, I think. He WAS’NT blind for Arwen’s beauty (I don’t know how and what ate “’” and two letters, maybe hungry orc)
Nevermind.
All situation is very sad. Faramir had feelings only for Aragorn, but I think he began adore Arwen too in some way and when she went for his decision he listened this call too, not the “first”.
Your questions… I meant Legolas gave Aragorn some advice in his ear, am I right? I hope he did’nt propose some relationship – triangle. I suffer for lack of words, I am sorry. I meant don’t make it quick. Whatever it will be.
I hope my English is’nt completely deteriorated and You could understand me a little.
I was thinking what I would do on Aragorn’s place, I really don’t know. Horrible difficulty!
I hope You understood my babbling – greetings – Barthemia

Hi Bartemia, nice to hear from you again!
“A very nice excuse”, do you think then it was not true? What do you mean when you said he lied to himself? What’s sad?
Please, please elaborate :).
As for updates, I am already working on the following chapter, but it is proving particularly tricky. I’m afraid it is already planned, but still I’d like to know exactly what you are asking for. What kind of choice? And what do you mean, too quick and shallow?

Anyway, I’m really happy that you are still interested in the story, grateful for your commenting, and very pleased with your compliments :). Thanks, thanks, thanks!

Hallo, Nerey Camille!
Wow… What can I say? Wow. Situation is bad. Very bad.Poor Aragorn. He is very unhappy and he does’nt know what he should do with his traitorous wife and Steward.
/sigh/You know, when Faramir told Aragorn “everything what I did I did from love for you”… I think it was very nice excuse. He was blind for Arwen’s beauty, he loved make love with her, he lie in some way, most to himself then. I believe he believes in his own words, but… It’s very sad.
I hope You’ll update soon and next part will be wonderful like all of them. A choice for them… please, don’t make it too quick and shallow.
Greetings! Bartemia.

Hi again!

Thanks for explaining! Yes, it’s clearer to me now. I’m glad that you like the tenderness between them and that it helps you understand why they have feelings for each other. I mean, Faramir would have feelings for just about anyone, he always sees the good side of people and grieves for their sorrows… And he’s so good at comforting and understanding that it’s only normal Arwen should have feelings for him.
As for desire, well… after all Arwen is the most beautiful creature ever since Lúthien :) and once Faramir’s heart is touched, how can his body remain indifferent?
And as for your feelings for Aragorn… strangely, the fic doesn’t have that effect on me. I don’t really think about Aragorn because he is not aware of the situation; if he was, things would change of course… Also, I don’t like Aragorn quite as much as Faramir.
Though I don’t like Arwen either and I must say, it’s a pleasure to work with her on this fic :).

I hope to get next chapter ready soon, it’s taking more work than I thought so it may be delayed a little.

Hi Nerey Camille,
You must’nt thank me. It was pleasure comment Your fic and “talk” in English : – )
Answers for Your questions, for example about Aragorn. I meant… I was thinking about Aragorn’s feelings (if he could know about all affair) more than the pair’s feelings, I don’t know why. I am usually Aragorn and Faramir’s fan in the same sympathy, equally. It must to be quality of Your story, if it wake these thinks in me…Of course I like them both very much.
I hope You understood my babbling and my explaining explained something.
“Is it the fact that Faramir accepts to become her lover, the fact that he truly desires her”. These two facts.
“And the description – do you mean the sexual scene”
Yes.In the first part of scene is tenderness and care, I like it…

Please note that according to our house rules, only positive feedback is allowed in comments. ‘If you don’t like something, move on,’ is our site policy.
So if you want to go into a full beta-reader style review, please conduct this conversation via email instead.

Thanks!

Yours,
iris

Hi Bartemia,

Feedback is giving your opinion on the positive and/or negative points of something. But I suppose I didn’t know myself what kind of information I was expecting when I asked you about this scene, so it’s normal you shouldn’t know exactly what to say. I’ve thought a bit about it and I think what I wanted to know is whether the scene looks realistic, both in the sexual sense (rythm and everything) and in the human sense (if the characters are credible). And I’d also be interested to know what effect it produces, if the reader finds their lovemaking beautiful, or scandalising, or very hot, or romantic, or whatever. If I understand you correctly, there’s a bit of everything?

On the other hand, when you don’t ask specific questions you have a better chance of getting original and unexpected feedback, which is great :).

You said that you didn’t understand their love, but my description made it easier. What is it that you don’t understand? Is it the fact that Faramir accepts to become her lover, the fact that he truly desires her, or the fact they love each other in some way? And the description – do you mean the sexual scene or the explanations I gave you in the comments above?

And what do you mean by “maybe I should throw this remembering/shadow of Aragorn out of my head, but how?” That intrigued me so much :).

As I said before, don’t worry about your feedback being “convenient” or good, all sorts of feedback are interesting and I’m so happy to discuss the story with you! So once again, great thanks!

Hallo, Nerey Camille,
I reread this scene between Arwen and Faramir and: I don’t know it will be good “feedback” (I don’t understand fully what it mean).
First I must confess I understood these words,“pommergranate seed” after two or five minuts (shamed by myself :-)
They were tender for each other, they… enjoyed their company, she was satisfied, he, I suppose, was too. When she said it about her undergarments, she wears them not when she go meet Faramir, it was nasty in some way. I don’t like Faramir with red, wet face, but it is my fault, because I like him and a little idealize him.
I don’t understand their love (my fault and idealising again) but Your description made my disunderstanding smaller. And this remembering/shadow of Aragorn – maybe I should throw it from my head off, but how?
Greetings!

Wow, it’s so very interesting to have your point of view on all this! And you’re not stupid, so don’t say that! It’s very difficult to guess how characters will react in a story written by someone else, especially if so far you find their reactions strange already…

Aaaargh, I can’t say if you’re right or not… I really must finish that chapter!

As for Faramir, I think if he really wanted the lies to end, he would have stopped things long ago. I really can’t imagine him being pleased, though maybe relieved in some small measure. But I really think that for him and Arwen, getting caught is first and foremost a dangerous and complicated situation. Having to face Aragorn about the affair with Arwen would be painful for Faramir in any case, for he doesn’t want the King to suffer. As for Arwen’s reaction, you’re right to think that it is the most unpredictable of all… at least for me :).

Well, with all the interest you have shown in this story I really think I ought to stop commenting and go back to work on the next chapter. But of course if you still have questions, I’ll be only too happy to answer them. And I am really most grateful for your comments, this chapter took a lot of work and I didn’t intend to continue with the story for some time, but now you’re making me feel like it was really worth the effort and I should keep working on it! So thanks a lot!

By the way, if you have time and you feel like it, I’d love to have your feedback on the sexual part of the chapter (it’s the first time I publish a scene with graphic sex). But don’t feel obliged, it’s really only if you have time and you’d like to give your opinion on it. There’s the option of sending a private message through the admins if you don’t like to publish it here.

Anyway, thanks a lot for your detailed analysis of the characters and the situation!

Seven Hells. In this case it must end very badly. Dissapointed, hurted in his – his trust and faith in Faramir Hurin will go straight to King… or… maybe… he will be demand answers for very difficult questions, questions without answers “how could you, Faramir etc”. It will be catastrophe!
I swear I don’t know. Arwen’s reaction is a riddle for me. Faramir’s? I don’t know, but maybe… he will be pleased. A little. Maybe he will be happy from end of lies. Maybe, I don’t know. I am stupid… It is complicated story.

Mmmm… interesting, though of course I can’t say if you’re right or not without uncovering the plot. Anyway I hope you will soon know what happens, next chapter is almost finished.

Still, there’s one fact to take into account: Húrin doesn’t necessarily know about the Orc invasion and Legolas’ visit (as a matter of fact, he doesn’t know). He’s only been ordered to look for the Steward urgently.

Also, I think your guesses about Húrin would be quite in character for him, but on the other hand, he’s been Faramir’s friend for so long. How could that affect his reaction?

And another interesting question: how will Faramir and Arwen react to this exceedingly dangerous situation, and to Húrin’s possible threat?